Interview: Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Basketball Scoring Champion

What was it like growing up in New York City in the 1950s and early '60s? What was your life like?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I thought I had a really great childhood. I can't complain about it. I had both parents that cared about me and nurtured and supported me, and taught me about discipline. They didn't let that slide. I don't consider myself spoiled. I did the normal things that kids did in New York in the '50s.

I went to the circus and the rodeo, and went to the library, and played baseball and stickball and swam. I visited my grandmothers in Brooklyn. Just the normal things, family and friends, and the magic of television. That was the earliest days of television, kind of a fascinating time.

Were you a good kid?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I considered myself to be a pretty good kid. I didn't get in a lot of trouble. My parents were disciplinarians. They didn't allow me a whole lot of leeway to act crazy. I didn't get that.

How did you like school? Were you a good student?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I was a pretty good student. My mom wanted to emphasize that school was a very important part of my life. She wanted me to do well, and I took that message to heart.

Did you have hobbies? What were the kinds of things that interested you as a kid growing up?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: The things that interested me the most growing up? I was a baseball fan. I wanted to play baseball. I couldn't be a cowboy because I did not live in the West, so baseball was the refuge there.

Did you have heroes?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I had heroes. Jackie Robinson was a big hero in my home, and of course, all the musicians. My dad was an avid musician. He thought that music was the pinnacle of artistic statement, so Duke Ellington and Count Basie and Nat King Cole and Sarah Vaughan and Billy Eckstine, they were always on the turntable, and they were icons.

Do you remember the first time you stepped on a basketball court?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I kind of vaguely do.

I first stepped on the basketball court at P.S. 52 in Upper Manhattan in Inwood. I remember it was during the summer when they would have the schools open for daytime activities for kids. I struggled just getting the ball up to the rim level. I couldn't do it at first. I had to heave the ball underhanded just to get it up to the rim. I didn't do well at all. I started to get pretty good in the 7th and 8th grades. Eighth grade, I dunked a ball in a game. That was pretty amazing in those days. I guess it would be amazing now. You know, 8th graders don't, by and large, have that kind of skill, but for me, I think it was just the issue that I was tall enough and I had been trying it long enough, I finally got to the point where I could do it.

You must have always been the biggest kid in your class. You were something like 6' 8" by the time you were in the 8th grade. Was that a problem for you?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Yeah, it was a problem. I was being scrutinized and always standing out. I was the only black kid quite often, so I always felt that I was a minority of one.

How did you handle that? How hard was it?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: It was kind of hard. You know, you always want to fit in and be just like everybody else, especially when you are young. So that was pretty tough for me, but I got used to it. You kind of accept your fate and try to live with it.

You have written about the year you spent at Holy Providence School. What lessons did you learn there?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Well, at Holy Providence School, I learned some tough lessons there. The other kids didn't appreciate the fact that I was a good student, and I was kind of singled out as an egghead, nerd kind of person. The only good thing that happened to me there was I got to play on the basketball team. That was fourth grade. That was the first year that I played basketball, and basketball was kind of like a refuge for me, but I couldn't wait to get out of there.

It has got to be tough on a young man to be in that kind of situation. Did that make you more determined to become the best you could be in your life?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Gee, I really didn't see that experience in terms of my whole life. It was just the couple of months that it was going to take for me to get out of there. Those were the most important parts of that scenario. I just wanted out.

You've referred to the year 1964 as a rite of passage. Can you tell us about that? How old were you? Sixteen or 17 years old?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I was 17 years old and got to participate in a program, the Harlem Youth Project.

Dr. John Clark really figured out a way to teach the kids in Harlem how to think about the future and what they could do to make Harlem a better place, and they had a number of workshops to try and get the kids involved in thinking about the future and what positive things they could do to contribute to life in Harlem. In order to do that, they had to know what Harlem was about. Being involved in the journalism workshop, we had to write about those things and put them in front of the participants in the program. So that required that I go and learn about the history of Harlem. That just opened my whole world up in terms of what had gone on before me, particularly the Harlem Renaissance. Because of the influence of my dad, the musician, I knew all about the musical aspects of it, but I didn't know very much about the other aspects of the Harlem Renaissance, and that really filled in what happened and why, and it made me very proud, and it made me a student of black history.

Were you always going to go to college?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I always was going to go to college. That was a goal that my parents identified for me; probably in fifth or sixth grade I was thinking about, "Gee, where am I going to go to college?" I recently found my grade school album. You write certain things in there about your future, and at that point I wrote in the space there, "Your Favorite College," and at that point I wrote UCLA. That surprised me to find that out. I always thought that that happened a little bit later, after seeing UCLA do so well in college basketball, but as early as the eighth grade I had picked the school that I wanted to go to.

When did you realize that basketball was going to be such an important part of your life?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I realized basketball was going to be an important part of my life probably somewhere in the seventh or eighth grade, when I started getting recruited to go to high school. In order to go to Catholic high school in New York, there was tuition, and already I had offers to go high school and not have to pay tuition. So at that point basketball started paying some bills, and I knew that to go to college, the same process would take place, and that would be another set of bills that I didn't have to pay, that basketball would take care of. I also knew that professional athletes made pretty good salaries, so it started to be something that started to loom on the horizon there, so to speak.

How hard did you have to work to become a good athlete, a good basketball player?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I had to work hard to become a good basketball player. You can just be tall and go out there and go through the motions, and you won't do very well. High school basketball in New York is a blood sport, it's a serious game. It's not something that's like a casual pastime. You'd better be at your best. It's almost like the whole world is watching. Kids in New York high school athletics, by and large, are very competitive. So from the very earliest, I was in a very competitive atmosphere and you want to be at your best. You just don't want to go through the motions, you want to distinguish yourself.

You could have gone to any college in America. Why did you choose to travel 3,000 miles across the country to go to UCLA?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I chose UCLA because my last two years in high school, UCLA won the "NC2A" tournament. Also, earlier, I remember seeing The Ed Sullivan Show when Rafer Johnson was on The Ed Sullivan Show. I knew Rafer Johnson was a world class athlete, but he was not on The Ed Sullivan Show as an athlete. He was on The Ed Sullivan Show as the President of the Student Body at UCLA. I was very impressed with that, that they appreciated him for more than his athletic ability. That said a lot about the attitudes at UCLA and that it would be a good place to go to school.

Also, there was a guy who played on the Knicks, Willie Naulls, who had gone to UCLA. He spoke highly of it, and he spoke highly of Coach Wooden. All in all, it all seemed to make sense. I got a chance to meet Coach Wooden that year on my recruiting trip to UCLA, and that more or less solidified it. He came to New York and spoke to my parents, and they were impressed. They thought I would be in good hands, and that was that.

Was it scary for a young man your age to be traveling across the country?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: No, it wasn't scary. There is a lot of adrenalin in that situation, but it's excitement. It's a new place, a new world, a new set of circumstances to deal with, and I thought it could only be better.

You have written that it was a tough year for you, that first year.

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Yeah, my first year at UCLA was tough. It was at times a lonely kind of situation. Going to school and playing basketball at a higher level -- it was very challenging, but I thought that I was up to the challenge, and things worked out very well.

What about the academic challenge? How different was it being a prospective All-American -- an athlete who could not miss -- and being a history major? How many of your teammates were serious students?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: When I was at UCLA, all of my teammates were serious students -- well, not all of them, but most of them -- and that was because Coach Wooden expected that. He wanted us to graduate. He let us know in the recruiting process that he wanted us to go to class and do well. He was just like a parent, a strict parent. He wanted us to do well. He was not someone that was just there to exploit us as athletes, and I have a lot of respect and undying love for Coach Wooden for that reason. He was not just some cynical opportunist. He really tried to show the love and caring that he had for the people that played sports for him, that was very important.

Are there any particular lessons, anything memorable that you take away from your relationship with John Wooden?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Gee, there are so many things that I learned from Coach Wooden that had nothing to do with sports. Coach Wooden really made us think about things beyond just playing basketball, and that was a very wonderful thing to have coming from the head coach. I started out as an English major and Coach Wooden, I could talk to him about the fine points of the English language -- whether to use a colon or semicolon, when to use parentheses, what was appropriate, "like" or "as" -- those types of things that an English major can tell you are confusing and can be kind of daunting at times. And it had nothing to do with sports. So for that reason alone, I really thought that I was in the right place and dealing with the right situation.

Those years you were at UCLA were turbulent years in America. How did that affect you?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think the turbulence of the '60s affected everybody, no matter where they were -- the Vietnam War, and the divide that happened to people lining up on either side of that. Also, the mid and late '60s really were the culmination of the civil rights movement, and all those things affected me on the campus at UCLA, but I thought I was in a very positive environment there. The people in and around UCLA seemed to have the right ideas on those matters, and I didn't ever feel that I had made a bad choice.

In 1968, you could have gone to the Olympics and played on the American basketball team, but you declined the invitation. Why was that?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I declined the invitation to go to the Olympics because I didn't feel that the Olympic situation was reality. Here we have this whole appearance of racial harmony on the American Olympic team when things weren't that harmonious here. In addition to that, I had a very good summer job that paid me a pretty good salary, and I needed that to tide me over for the school year, and I couldn't do both things. So I figured I had better go with what was going to benefit my life, as opposed to benefiting the Olympic movement, which I saw as very hypocritical.

The gentleman that was in charge of the U.S. Olympic team, Avery Brundage, to me, was a very controversial figure. I believe in the 1930s he had supported the Nazi Party at one point. It was not somebody I wanted to work for. I didn't want to deal with him or the Olympics, so it was pretty easy for me to make my choice.

You must have taken some heat for that.

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I took a lot of heat for that, but I had good reasons not to go. I thought it would be better if I didn't go, as opposed to going and being a problem for everybody, and being a disruptive element there. I let them do their thing, and I was going to do my thing.

A lot of big men have played basketball without ever becoming the kind of player you were. How do you account for your achievements on the basketball court?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think my achievements on the basketball court came from a whole lot of things coming together in one place and one person. I was able to learn the game from some of the best teachers, and I had particular skills that translated well to playing the game. So the knowledge that I had and the physical gifts that I had gave me the opportunity to be a very good player, and I was able to take advantage of that.

By the same token, there have been teams with very talented players that never won an NCAA or NBA championship. What does it take to win a championship at any level?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: In order to win a championship, you have to have a lot of parts that fit together, and you have to have the opportunity to win. So in order to win, you really have to have a lot of things happen the right way. You have to have good leadership, coaching, and you have to have a talented team that can come together as a unit. And I think the reason that UCLA's teams did so well was that Coach Wooden's ideas on unity and team play really were cutting edge and the best. He taught those elements of the game the best of any coach in the country. You combine that with talented athletes and you're going to have a winning program.

There is a story that is always told about Coach Wooden, that he would teach his teams how to put their socks on. Do you remember that? How did that help you become better teams?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: The first day that you go to play for Coach Wooden, he tells you about how to put your socks on. And the reason he does that is because his system requires that you do everything on the run. You don't jog through things, you have to run full speed. The wear and tear on your feet is immediate and intense, and if your socks aren't on right, if you have like a ridge that you're running over in your sock, you're going to get a blister and then you won't be able to practice, and if you don't practice for Coach Wooden, you don't play. So he was telling everybody how to survive his system and get through it without coming up with blisters on their feet.

How does life in the NBA compare to life in a major college basketball program?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think life in the NBA was pretty easy, because you are getting paid to do something that you have done for free prior to that. You get paid pretty well, and that is all that you have to do, so all other distractions are on the periphery and you can concentrate completely on basketball. If you have a good foundation in the game, you can do very well.

You had an amazing record of winning games, at every level, but you didn't win them all. There had to have been setbacks and disappointments and difficulties. What were your disappointments and difficulties and how did you overcome them?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: In the professional game?

There are disappointments for any competitive athlete, because you can't win all the time. Coach Wooden taught us this. He taught us that you can only come out and give your best effort. That is all you can do. The outcome is not determined by anything that you have control over. The only thing you have control over is your effort and then the effort of your group, your team, and when you put together a good effort consistently, you have a chance to win, and everybody wants to win, but there is only one team that can win it all, and you have to accept that. As long as you put your best effort out there, you should be satisfied with that, and not be down on yourself.

Were you ever nervous? Did you ever have doubts or fear of failure in your career?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I had self doubts when I was a freshman in high school. I was 14 years old and not very mature, and there were a few incidents in my freshman year. I learned in a very competitive environment. The high school environment that I played in was very intense, and I learned how to be stoic and go out and compete. My high school coach was very good at working with me, working with people. He never berated anybody or embarrassed them if they went out and played hard, and stuck to our team plan. I was very fortunate to have good coaching like that, both in high school and then again in college with Coach Wooden.

Are there any incidents that you had to deal with that stand out, or that young people could learn from?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Oh yeah. My very first high school game, I was 14 years old and we went to play a team in Brooklyn and got whipped. There was one player on the team that was doing Globetrotter tricks against our team. It was pretty bad. After the game, I came into the locker room and I felt so bad about my performance I started crying, and at that time I was 14 years old. At that age, you can be either more mature than your years or less mature in certain ways. In this particular set of circumstances, I was less mature. I was a lot closer to being 12 years old than I was to being 16 years old. So I'm crying, and I remember I looked up and all of the other guys in the locker room were looking at me like I had just landed from Mars. Crying at a time like that, like a little kid, and my maturity level just did a leap of maybe four or five years at that point. I realized that I had to leave that childish emotion and self-pity behind and learn how to compete and get with it. It was a pretty intense moment in my life and one that I refer to a lot in terms of focus and determination.

There must have been tough times for you, the 7-foot black American, in a country in racial turmoil, a country where racism was embedded into the institutions and into the system.

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Yes, the racial atmosphere in the early '60s was not a pleasant thing to endure, because America has a way of not acknowledging racial attitudes, and at other times taking the attitude that "things will change later. " Of course, things have to change now if there is going to be any progress now. So the impatience in communities that felt racial oppression was very, very intense. The whole idea of "Freedom Now" emerged in the '60s, and it was something that I had to debate with my peers almost on a daily basis.

How did those debates turn out usually?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think people started to get the idea that certain things did have to change if America was going to be the place that it put itself up to be. People like Dr. King and Malcolm X really intensified the debate and made people deal with the issues, and that went across the board. I don't think any group or any individuals really got a chance to not participate. You had to participate. These things affected you no matter who you are or where you were.

Everyone in public life, athletes included, is subject to criticism. How do you handle criticism?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I handle criticism by understanding that you can't please everybody and you should live according to your own standards, especially if they are reasonable. As long as you know that you have done the best that you can in whatever circumstances that you are in and you are honest, you should be able to handle any criticism that arises, because you understand within yourself that you're not perfect. You can't please everybody, and if you understand that, you can move on.

How hard is it to understand that?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think after a considerable amount of time in the public eye, you understand that this is just the way that things are, that people are going to criticize you and you can't please everybody. As long as you do the best you can in an honest effort, you should be all right.

You were raised Catholic, you went to Catholic schools, and you made a decision in the early '70s to become a Muslim. How did that come about?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: My interest in Islam started when I was a freshman at UCLA and I got the opportunity to read The Autobiography of Malcolm X, and it really made me understand that there was a lot more to monotheism than what I knew being raised as a Roman Catholic. I found in Islam that I certainly had a limited view of what monotheism was about, and it made me curious enough to read the Koran and see that it probably was something that I needed to investigate more completely. I was won over by the arguments. The fact that the Roman Catholic Church was greatly invested in the slave trade did not help me want to remain Catholic, and because of that, I changed my affiliation.

I embraced Islam basically after reading The Autobiography of Malcolm X, which gave me a different perspective on monotheism and the history of religions.

What has it meant to you to be a Muslim?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think Islam has given me a moral foundation. It gave me a way of trying to balance your own personal ambitions, what you want and need in the world, with some type of morality and a way of viewing what life is about. It certainly doesn't help, at this point now, that there are so many problems with the Islamic world. But I think those have to do with politics, and the Islamic world's reaction to colonialism and being exploited, a lot more than really is based on religious belief. Because all of the religions that come from Abraham basically have the same message. Not very much difference if you can study it objectively, but that is hard to do in this day and age when there is so much politics and nationalism and resentment for things that have gone on centuries ago. It's kind of hard to overcome.

Has it been tougher in America in the last five years to be a follower of Islam?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: It has been very tough to be a Muslim in America ever since 9/11. Just the fact that Muslims were responsible for such an atrocity, how do you explain that? People aren't really willing to listen without saying that all Muslims feel that way, or there is something inherent in Islam that encourages people to go out and indiscriminately murder. It is not the case, but that is what has happened.

We'd like to talk about your life off the basketball court. You've written several books now. How do you choose the topics for your books?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: When I am writing a book, I just choose a topic that I think is interesting and relevant, and something that people would want to know about, and I try and make a coherent presentation of what I see.

Surely it also has to be something that you feel is important. What is important to you, off the basketball court?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Well, off the basketball court, I think that making the world a better place, making my environment a better place, my community, my country. I think that is something that all people should aspire to. If you improve yourself, if you improve your environment, you are contributing to the good of all people, and I think that is a worthy thing for people to aspire to.

You have written a book about the Harlem Renaissance of the 1920s and '30s. What is the importance to you personally of the Harlem Renaissance?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Well, for me the Harlem Renaissance epitomizes the pinnacle of the efforts of black people to contribute to American life. I think that the aspirations of the participants in the Harlem Renaissance were such that we should know about it. I think especially young black people today should use that as a template for what they can do with their lives. They can use it as a means to see what their aspirations can bring forward. The poetry of Langston Hughes, the music of Duke Ellington, the social commentary of people like W.E.B. DuBois, all of these are things that made a difference in America and made a difference in black life. I think that is something that our young people should learn about.

You have written about the importance of jazz in your life. What does jazz mean to you? Why is it important to you?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Jazz, to me, is important because it is an expression of joy. It is an expression of people who, even though they were living in oppressive circumstances, were not going to take the negativity as the last statement on all circumstances, that things could change and that hope certainly was part of the process, and that change was -- even more than being possible -- inevitable.

Is that what it is about? A sense of possibility, a sense of hope against obstacles?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: A sense of hope against obstacles, and a sense of joy when those obstacles are overcome, and that every little victory can be celebrated in the moment.

I think you've said in your book that jazz even helped you become a better basketball player. How is that?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Certainly music helps you to do things with more joy, and just what you learn about timing and harmony, and your reaction to the choices that the people around you make, which is part of the jazz experience. All those things can help an athlete.

You hear the sportscasters talk about athletes or things being in rhythm or out of rhythm. Is there a beat, is there a tempo, is there a rhythm going through your head when you are out there on the court?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: There is a certain group dynamic that happens with a jazz band, and it's the same thing that happens on the playing field. What the group is trying to do in their efforts to achieving that goal, that's something that is shared, and it is something that the team has to be aware of collectively. They have to act as a unit. They can't just do it all as individuals. That cohesion of the unit makes for great team play, and it also makes for great music.

This might be an unfair question, but what do you consider your greatest achievement so far?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: My greatest achievement, I think, has been being a successful parent, sending my kids to school. They are all college grads. They understand who they are, where they are, and have made a good statement with their lives. I think that has been the best thing that I have done.

When you were growing up, what influenced you? What were the important things in your life, whether they were individuals or books or events or music?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think I certainly enjoyed seeing the Brooklyn Dodgers win the World Series in 1955. That was a very special moment. I will never forget that. Playing on the city championship team for three years in a row in high school, that was very special for me, something I enjoyed. Doing well at UCLA both as a student and as an athlete, that was very important to me. Doing well as a professional basketball player, being consistent, and being able to make the All Star team and be the Most Valuable Player in the league, that is something I am proud of as a personal achievement.

Was there a book you read as a young man that enlightened you in some way, that inspired you or challenged you?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think The Autobiography of Malcolm X, by Alex Haley, really inspired me to know more and to emulate the positive growth that Malcolm X went through. He started out on a very negative path. He was a thief and someone involved in the underworld, and he grew out of that. His exposure to the teachings of the Nation of Islam made him want to change, and then when he saw that the Nation of Islam had some problems, he put that behind him, and through Islam -- orthodox Islam -- he found a better path, and he never stopped trying to improve himself and increase his knowledge. I think that is a great example for anyone.

If a young person came to you for advice, what would that advice be? What would you say to them?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think the statement that "knowledge is power" is a very succinct way of getting the message across that you have to know what is right, you have to pursue what is right, and the only way that you can know and do these things is to acquire knowledge. Flailing around in the dark does not help anyone.

As you look ahead into the 21st century, what do you see as the greatest challenges to America as a country?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think America has the challenge ahead of it of making the promise of the Constitution real for everyone. Everyone needs to have the opportunity to succeed. That's a very difficult thing to make happen. A lot of societies have tried that and failed. I think we have to continually reassess and reinvent how we approach the promise of the American Dream.

If there is one problem you could solve, what would it be?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: If there was one problem I could solve, I would want to deal with the issue of equality, equality of opportunity. The only way that I see that we can make that a reality is to educate everyone, to make the educational system work for all segments of society, the rich and the poor. That has not happened, and we have the problems that we have based mainly on the lack of opportunity for people who don't get the education that they need to contribute to society.

Does an athlete as prominent as yourself have a special responsibility? Are you role models?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think all prominent people, no matter what field they are in, have a responsibility to show others how to get things done. The whole idea of sharing your knowledge and allowing other people to see how to succeed, I think that is very important. I think that works for everyone. It is my hope that that becomes the norm for America.

How do you personally measure achievement? How do you measure success?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I measure success basically by seeing how far a person can go in whatever field that they choose. If you choose to write, can you get something published that people will want to read? I think that is a pretty straightforward example of someone attempting and succeeding at an effort. For other people, having the ability to go out and support themselves, if they can do that, and get to the point where they can raise and support a family, I think that is another great achievement. It doesn't always have to be spectacular stuff, it just has to be living a normal life.

What gave you a greater sense of achievement or joy, winning an NBA championship, beating the Celtics, whatever you did as an athlete, or seeing one of your books in print?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think seeing one of my books in print has given me as much joy and sense of achievement as winning an NBA championship. Although I don't get the notoriety from my books that I have gotten as an athlete, it still gives me great joy to know that I can contribute to American life something significant. Well, it is significant to me, and possibly the people who pick up my books and read them get some fulfillment out of it. I think that to me is very meaningful and it gives me a lot of joy.

Do you ever think about the fact that you are called the greatest to ever play the game, that no one ever played basketball better than Kareem Abdul-Jabbar?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think that what I achieved as an athlete is really wonderful, but limited, and I think that the books I have written, after I am dead, people can still read them. I have stopped contributing anything on the basketball court. I do a little bit of coaching, but the books I have written are able to spread knowledge and inform people, and that will continue after I have passed on. I think that really makes me feel special in ways that my achievement in sports have not. Mark Twain is a hero of mine. I have written some things that might last in the same way that Huck Finn has lasted. It has that possibility. That is a special thing for me.

How would you like to be remembered? What would you like to have as a legacy?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I think my legacy is the fact that I was able to do well as an athlete and as a scholar. I am very proud of that, and I hope people can understand and learn from the things that I have written long after I am gone. I hope that that is what happens.

By the way, your new book is terrific.

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Thank you very much. It was fun writing it.

You should be really be proud of that.

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I am. I remember the first book I wrote some 25 years ago, it was very difficult, just being public with private information. That was my autobiography. I remember like six weeks before it was getting ready to come out on the bookstands, I wanted them to stop the project, because I said, "I can't be public like that," and with every publication since then, the process has gotten easier and I think the books have improved.

How tough is it for you to face that blank page, or a blank computer screen?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: I don't think that is tough, because if you have an idea of something meaningful to communicate, you can move forward on that. You might not be successful in communicating what you want to communicate, but at least you have an idea of something that needs to be said, or something that you think should be said, and I think you go from there.

Is there anything we haven't talked about that you want to talk about?

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: No. If you are happy, I am happy.

You have been very generous with your time. We appreciate that and we thank you very much.

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: The pleasure is mine.